S H A D O W . G E N E R A T I N G . P E T I T I O N

About RBR track editor

S H A D O W . G E N E R A T I N G . P E T I T I O N

Postby delu77 » Thu Feb 25, 2010 9:12 am

Hi everybody,
I am here to ask for shadows.
I know it is a Wally work, but with all the tracks near to be released (6 from Lamda, 1 from me, 1 from Eno and RBR-online DevTrackTeam and more soon) I'd like to know how to generate shadows.
I have sent Wally during September a track to work on for shadows generating, but I can't ask him everyday how is going.
So, if you are with me, I'd like to know the secrets of shadows generating.
Don't mind if it takes long time to work, I have time for testings, but wait more than 5 months to know if Wally is still working on shadows is longer.

So please, who knows, write here.

Thanks a lot,
Andrea
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Re: S H A D O W . G E N E R A T I N G . P E T I T I O N

Postby Admal » Thu Feb 25, 2010 1:10 pm

As i know wally had never share this secret or any tool. So we can only ask himself for a solve for that problem. Ithink best way would be a discussion on one table.

My realistic personal possibillitys:
-Maybe he share a part of his skill, so we can exculpate him from some time killing parts. So he will not lost control and for us it´s going faster.
-Otherwise he skill up someone more, which can help him (someone which has his trust)
-release track without shadows first (v0.9). If shadows ready, switch to 1.0 (same as plankgas track). There will only a problem for cz plugin, there will not implement without shadows


Only blackf know enough about RBR editing. But i´m sure he will not help. He and Wally, that would be explosive mixture....

For germangarage will it more bad. We built a big map with 4 different routes. But for shadowmaking every version must handle as own track. After finish first track we need for building next version aprox two month for changes (maybe more less). If it going fast as history, it would be 2012 for last release.

Lamda
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Re: S H A D O W . G E N E R A T I N G . P E T I T I O N

Postby delu77 » Thu Feb 25, 2010 1:52 pm

I Know secrets are secrets...
Only if Wally want, I can give him a name who can help him with programming, or, as you said, we can learn how to do with his tools.

Eno has started something with an alpha layer, something like "blending to texture", maybe it can be a start... :roll:
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Re: S H A D O W . G E N E R A T I N G . P E T I T I O N

Postby eno72 » Thu Feb 25, 2010 3:50 pm

yes, I started something, but I call it "the shadows of the poor", almost "made in China".... :D

Anyhow, if this is a petition, I will certainly sign, let's hope to have these tools in next version of Wallaby, as anticipated one year ago.
I think that we will be more than happy to dedicate our time for shadows generation, and, with the increasing number of tracks being made, we frankly cannot ask Wally to do this huge amount of work.
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Re: S H A D O W . G E N E R A T I N G . P E T I T I O N

Postby Wally » Sun Feb 28, 2010 9:03 pm

Hi,

delu77, I have your track already with shadows. I will send it to you next week.

But please excuse me, from november? I asked you twice for tracksettings.ini, because I need it for shadows generation. There is 1 parameter called SunDir, which must be same by shadow generation and in tracksettings.ini. Of course I can choose this parameter by myself, but its better for designer to choose this by himself.

To shadowing algo: Its feature of Wallaby, but still not fully finished, so it is not also public. I worked on this algorithm over year, but still it is in 2/3 of original RBR editor (Kangaroo). Everyone must send track for shadow generation. Take it or leave it.

Shadow generation by myself helps me tune algo, so it will work (I hope) with more and more tracks without touching on algo. Maybe someday it will be in Wallaby, but it can be also payed part of Wallaby. But its not thing for next days or weeks.

Of course there are also other methods than my, but I thing they are not much good. I choose similar way as original authors, so its written directly for RBR. Other methods are just workarounds with not much good results (big textures files, too sharp shadows, ...).
Wally
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Re: S H A D O W . G E N E R A T I N G . P E T I T I O N

Postby delu77 » Mon Mar 01, 2010 12:00 pm

This would be not like an attack, mine was only a question.
Anyway, first time I've sent the tracksettings were on august 2009, the 18th, so I was too much "good" by saying november. This is not a problem mate! :mrgreen:

You talk about Kangaroo....you know how it works by saying "as original authors". Maybe we can help you :roll:

Cheers and thanks again,
Andrea
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Re: S H A D O W . G E N E R A T I N G . P E T I T I O N

Postby Bostjan Berglez » Mon Mar 01, 2010 6:16 pm

@Wally: just curious: Do you own or have seen kangooro? I heard a lot about this original trackmaking software, but on the end it is like bigfoot :) Everybody knows it, but nobody has seen it :) And I must say I would really like to see it in action.

Probably waiting somwhere to be found in some dusty archives :(
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Re: S H A D O W . G E N E R A T I N G . P E T I T I O N

Postby Bostjan Berglez » Mon Mar 01, 2010 6:23 pm

Aha.. and something else just crossed my mind. You all guys have probably seen the trackmaking tutorial for Rally Trophy. It is an interesting movie showing actually a lot how to create a track. There is a particular situation how shadows are generated in max. The movie timeline shows 23:25. I wonder can this method be used also for RBR or shadows are lost during X export?

I uploaded the movie also here: http://www.b2-net.com/download/doc_download/41-track-making-tutorial-rally-trophy
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Re: S H A D O W . G E N E R A T I N G . P E T I T I O N

Postby delu77 » Tue Mar 02, 2010 8:18 am

Bostjan Berglez wrote:Aha.. and something else just crossed my mind. You all guys have probably seen the trackmaking tutorial for Rally Trophy. It is an interesting movie showing actually a lot how to create a track. There is a particular situation how shadows are generated in max. The movie timeline shows 23:25. I wonder can this method be used also for RBR or shadows are lost during X export?

I uploaded the movie also here: http://www.b2-net.com/download/doc_download/41-track-making-tutorial-rally-trophy


It can't works, IMHO, cause here seems that you can use only a single texture for the track, and you know RBR don't do it :cry:
BTW, it is a nice idea!
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Re: S H A D O W . G E N E R A T I N G . P E T I T I O N

Postby Wally » Thu Mar 04, 2010 8:33 pm

I saw Kangaroo on pictures (1 or 2) and also hear, how it roughly worked. Most things are just only guessed. I dont think we will see by own eyeball in our life. That was also reason I started developing my tool. By the way name Wallaby is not from my nick, but Wallaby is small Kangaroo in Australian ;)

http://images.google.com/images?hl=cs&g ... &q=wallaby


Ad shadows from Rally Trophy). RBR uses multilayer textures and I did not found any tool/exporter, which is able export more layers to .x file. It is exporting always only first layer. In RBR are used up to 4 layers. Two normal textures mixed, one for shadows and one for specular.
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